Hands Off Cary Green.

[Dave]

I personally feel that after Oldway Mansions in Paignton, the Torquay Pavilion is the next best building in Torbay. It’s hard to believe that at the time of its construction there were many objections to it being built. But then that is nothing new and the Bay like most places will always find people wanting to object to some development or other.

I remember at the age of ten being a member of the scout movement, being taken to this once grand old theatre to watch my very first Gang Show. Years later I watched a number of comedy plays that were a regular feature at the theatre in the 1970s it was proposed that the theatre was knocked down, but thankfully it became a listed building in 1973.

It was closed in 1976 and then leased to Rank who destroyed the wonderful interior of this fine building when they turned it into an indoor skating rink. It was not a real ice rink and I did use it myself when it first opened. It was good family fun but back then I had very little interest in old buildings and architect and I happened to think it was a welcome addition to Torbay.

Rank closed it down and the inside of the building was then concerted into a shopping arcade, at first it was very successful but over the years it has declined and to be honest, it’s not worth any effort to go inside. Many units are empty and it just looks so tatty and in need of some much love, care and restoration.

In a perfect world it would be fully restored to its former glory but that is never going to happen, the damage to the inside of the building has been done and anyway, why would anyone want to spend money on returning the building to its intended use. It’s such a shame the building was not valued for what it really was before it was handed over to the Rank organisation, then we might have still had a wonderful old theatre that was full of history.

I walk past the old Paignton picture house often that is all boarded up and pray that one day someone will do something about that fine building and not let the inside be destroyed as was the case with the Torquay Pavilion.

Why do we not look after some of the wonderful buildings we do have in Torbay, why was the council allowed to let Oldway Mansions get into the state that the only way to save the building was to sell it at a giveaway price to be turned into a hotel? A wonderful building given to the people of Torbay and now seeing its grounds being filled with housing and we will I fear, lose the access to the building we once all enjoyed.

The Pavilions will go the same way I’m afraid as Harbour Hotels wants to create a £20MILLION four-star spa hotel with 45 apartments at Torquay's Pavilion and marina car park site. In their original plans they wanted to build tower blocks of apartments as high as Rock Walk on the Cary Green, how ugly would they have looked? Would they really have done anything to improve the area? NO in my opinion and thankfully that idea has now been thrown out and is not going to happen.

But Cary Green is far from safe as Harbour Hotels now want that land to build a car park on it. The excising Marine car park will be knocked down to build those apartments on and building high price apartments on waterfronts are something that is happening everywhere. So many of them sold as second homes and empty most of the year.

They do nothing to add very much to places like Torbay, its all about some company making loads of money and the idea of letting them do that was so they would spend money on stopping Cary Green sinking any further. It seems that is something no longer being talked about and without that happening, I do not think there is any good reason to allow Harbour Hotels to get their hands on the Pavilion and the marina car park.

Having those repairs done might have been an acceptable trade off, but not without them and most certainly not if Cary Green is going to be turned into a car park. Do we need any more hotels in Torbay? NO as we have lost so many bed spaces due to the decline of visitors to the Bay, do we need some large tower block of second homes build right next to the Pavilion building? NO again is my answer and if there needs to be development in that area, put something there that would be beneficial for not only the local people, but our visitors as well.





The history of the Pavilion

The Pavilion was built on a site formed partly of land reclaimed from the sea, on a concrete raft on which a framework of steel stanchions and girders was erected. Henry Augustus Garrett, Borough Engineer of Torbay laid out the Princess Gardens, the Terrace Walk, Pier Pavilion and Torquay Pavilion: the work lasted from 1890 to 1930. The architect of the Pavilion was Edward Rogers, winner of a competition in 1896, who, with HC Goss drew up the final plans, which were passed in 1903. Because of Rogers’ death construction started only in 1911, the work having been taken over by Garrett. The facing tiles, in Doulton’s Carrara enamelled stoneware made the Pavilion appear like a white Palace.

The impressive central copper-covered dome was topped with a life size figure of Britannia. Two smaller domes on each side of the entrance were surmounted by copper figures of Mercury. Fine cast ironwork in Art Nouveau style edged the steps to the promenade deck and the octagonal bandstands or summerhouses. Other exterior decorations were of flowers, urns topped with pineapples, scrolls, etc.

Opened in 1912, there was a foyer and auditorium with lounges and cafe, all oak-panelled and elegantly plastered. There was a curved balcony, stained glass and potted palms, with open-air promenade and tea garden

[aussie]

you know Gordon Oliver has his mucky little fingers in this particular pie? it will happen, look into all the councillors investment portfolios and you'll soon see how local government is run as a power/profit making entity! it's beyond criminal in my book, they basically steal from the electorate by setting deals up to work in their individual favour! their as corrupt as the mafia, we have seen them done for fiddling expenses, that is just the tip of the iceberg!

[Dave]

The fight to save Cary Green is very much on and gaining much support in the Bay. I love the Pavilion building and do not want to see it left empty to fall into rack and ruin. We have already lost one wonderful building Oldway Mansions now being converted into a hotel with housing build in the grounds. A fine building that belonged to the people of Torbay but badly neglected by Torbay Council.

Is the price of saving the Pavilion having yet another unneeded hotel built on the harbour side along with a tower block that will consist of mainly second homes? Plus the loss of Cary Green? How many hotels have closed down in the Bay over the last ten years? How many of them ended up being torched and then new blocks of flats etc being built on the sites? The question I’m asking is does Torbay really need more new hotels? Lets be honest we no longer get the number of visitors we once did and there are many good reasons why that is the case.

To me it looks like the real money will be made on the new apartment block that will tower high above the inner harbour. Are such blocks really good for the local economy? pop along to Exmouth and look at all the blocks built on the waterfront, most look empty and unlived in most of the year.

Torbay like so many other small towns badly needs new investment, but it has to be the right sort of investment that will enhance and benefit the Bay, sorry I can’t see how building a new hotel and a tower block is really going to achieve that.

Its all very well Jim Parker of the Herald Express wishing Torbay was more like Exeter, we are not as Exeter is a city and very well placed just off the M5 corridor. Go and walk around the lower end of George Street in Plymouth and you will find so many now empty shops and soon get the feeling Plymouth is sadly going down hill.

So many high streets are suffering all over the country; the internet is partly to blame along with local councils making it almost imposable for traders to survive in our town centres. The very layout of Torquay makes it very difficult to have the sort of shopping centre we can see at Exeter. Its so much easier for companies to operate out of Exeter due to having the M5 right along side. Even when the new road into the Bay is completed, it won’t make much difference as far as attracting new companies to set up in the Bay is concerned.


Torbay is simply not in the best location, but Torbay is a beautiful place and does have so much going for it. Why do so many people want to come and live here if that were not the case? The Southwest has recently been voted as the happiest place to live in the UK, something I would agree with and why is that the case? Low crime levels, less stress and so much natural beauty where you look.

There are those who prefer to live in a large city, each to their own I say, you have to live where you are happy and what one person likes may not be the same as someone else. It just comes down to personal choice and nothing more, some like the high life, others prefer a more quite sort of life.

The people standing up and opposing this new hotel etc will I’m sure have the nimbe label stuck all over them, but I do not see it that way. I would rather people stand up and ask the questions before everything is lost under concrete.

Will the developers get their way? I fear they will as the Pavilion building will now be left empty to fall into rack and ruin and to save it them will mean letting them have it all on their terms.

[Dave]

for anyone who may be interested, someone has set up a Save Cary Green page on Facebook.


here is a link to the page

Save Cary Green

[Dave]

Save Cary Green Petition

Please help save Cary Green by clicking on the link about and signing the petition.

below the wording taken from the petition



Save Torquay's Cary Green from being turned into a car park as part of a new hotel development on the harbourside.

Torquay’s Cary Green has been an important open space in central Torquay for well over a century, and is enjoyed all-year round by a multiplicity of locals and tourists. They use the Green for community events, picnics, family get-togethers, relaxing walks and as place to enjoy the fresh air. Tourism is fundamentally important to the prosperity of Torquay, and Cary Green, with its palm trees, fountains and grassy banks, is an essential tourist attraction enabling many visitors to enjoy the best of the English Riviera. Furthermore, a statue of Torquay’s most famous resident, Agatha Christie, unveiled in Cary Green in 1990, has made the area even more important as part of the highly-popular Agatha Christie Mile. This successful scheme is helping to put Torquay back on the map.

Additionally, the use of Cary Green as a car park for a proposed new luxury hotel is both unnecessary and counter-productive. There are several car parks nearby, the closest of which is the underused Fleet Walk multi-storey car park, which is just a few metres away from Cary Green. Negotiations could easily be made for a valet parking system which would escort guests from Fleet Walk to the new hotel, eliminating the supposed need for a car park on Cary Green. Losing the Green to a new car park would ultimately serve to decrease the long-term popularity of Torquay with tourists, nullifying any benefits brought by a new hotel.

With this petition we can help to save an indispensable green space which is historically, culturally, and aesthetically vital. The area has already been marred by the construction of a multi-storey car park in the 1980s, and it would be a travesty if this beautiful Green, and jewel in Torquay’s crown, were to be allowed to be turned into a car park. Instead, it should both protected and preserved for posterity.

[Dave]

Well it turns out that after reading this thread, someone decided to not only set up a face book page, but also get the online petition up and running. The petition was only started sometime on Saturday and it has gained 724 signatures already so its clear so many people care about Cary Green and want to see it remain as it is.

I have taken the time to read the many comments that have been added and fully agree with all of them. While the Imperial Hotel is no longer a five star hotel, it is a four star hotel and the best one in the Bay and would in my opinion, always be the first choice hotel in the Bay for those who are looking to stay in the very best sort of hotel.

While the new proposed hotel is meant to be a four star one, I’m sure anyone staying there would not be very happy on a Saturday being so close to Torquay harbour and all his night life. Is there any reason other than cost why the hotel could not have an underground car park? One reason might be that it could flood if the sea broke over the sea wall, but then if it did then the hotel would also suffer as well. I think its just down to cost and how easy would it be to clear the green and just lay some tarmac on it?

I personally feel the hotel would fail and very quickly end up being turned into flats, more second homes that will do nothing to help the Torquay economy along with the other ones that would be in that six + story block. A block that will end up BLOCKING so many views and for what?

They wanted to build tower blocks as high as Wreck Walk beside the Pavilions and were meant to be paying to have the work done to stop the gardens sinking as they are doing. But they did not like the price tag and came up with this next plan to get those very expensive flats built they are after. Flats not needed as you can bet none of them will be sold as affordable housing to the less well off.

Thanks to Torbay council we now have Wreck Walk instead of our much loved Rock Walk, we had to endure that bloody ugly balloon on our seafront, the one the owner ended up never paying the rent that was due. Thanks to them we have lost Oldway Mansions and have to watch as the grounds of that fine wonderful building fills up with new built homes.

Thanks to Torbay council we have lost so many of our regularly visitors, all fed up with over the top car parking charges and over zealous traffic wardens. How can you go from 4000 parking tickets a year to well over 32.000 and tell me its not all about ripping off as many people as possible. Town centres in the Bay now struggling even more as people refuse to fill those on street parking meters and don’t even get me started about the parking meters on Paignton seafront. The ones only the locals have had to pay to use during the winter months, but that will change very soon as Torbay council will I’m sure, make changes so car parking can take place there during the summer months.

They plan to turn the road past Wreck Walk back to how it was and only so they can get more parking meters in that location. It will mean hold ups as cars try and reverse into an empty space, leave it alone as it works perfectly fine as it is.

Listen to the people of Torbay and look to bring in the right sort of investment that will enhance the Bay for its visitors and those who live here. Make Torbay a place of welcome and not a place you leave with a bad taste in your mouth. The Bay is beautiful, do not ruin it anymore.